Fed up with four-wheelers

BY TODD L. DISHER
Frontiersman
Published on Thursday, July 9, 2009 7:56 PM AKDT

MAT-SU — When their windows rattle at 3 a.m., residents in the Seldon Road Extension area know not to duck and cover.

It’s not an earthquake. It’s not a landslide. It’s not the first salvo of a North Korean missile attack. It’s four-wheelers.

To connect Seldon to Church Road, the road bed needed to be wider. Cutting into the hill created a steep bank on the south side of Seldon. The project was completed in 2007, and the slope was hydro-seeded in 2008 to prevent erosion.

(Use arrows above to view more photos)

Ryah’s Way intersects with Seldon and cuts through the slope. With two steep slopes facing each other and the slope along Seldon, the area could not have been better designed for high-marking and hill climbing.

Paul Reed moved to the north of Seldon in 2006. He said the four-wheelers started showing up this summer. Now, the slope is scarred with tracks worn in the newly-established grass.

“We call it the amphitheater,” Reed said. “The noise bounces off the hills and shoots into the neighborhood.”

“It’s not just four-wheelers either. In the winter, it’s snowmachines,” said local resident Jesse Carnahan.

Carnahan and Reed said it would be fine if the riders rode through the area to access the hills or Bald Mountain, but they are using the slope as their playground. The machines go up and down repeatedly and at all hours of the night, they said.

Steve Anderson agreed. He said he does not want to ban the riders outright, “but for them to think that this is a place to ride, it’s just nonsense. (...) Try putting your kid to sleep when it’s this hot outside and you have to keep the windows closed because of the noise.”

Carnahan said he confronted a group of snowmachiners who were hill climbing at 3 a.m. on a work day.

“That group listened,” Carnahan said, “but we’ve had the normal story too.”

“Normally, they just flip you off,” Reed explained.

Carnahan said he just moved into his house a year ago, but the problem is so bad he is ready to move. Reed shot back, saying that he has already offered his house for sale.

“I would like to enjoy the peace and quite,” the disabled veteran Reed said. “I’m a recovering cancer patient. I don’t need the stress.”

Reed said he has talked to everyone he could think of, but he has reached nothing but dead ends. The city of Wasilla said they can’t do anything because it’s outside of city limits. The Alaska State Troopers told him it was low on their priority list. By the time they respond to a call, the riders are long gone anyway, Reed said.

“What happens when your little kid is going down the sidewalk when they are blasting through?” Anderson said. “I’m sure they won’t do it on purpose, but accidents happen.”

Mat-Su Borough Manager John Duffy said the conflict of four-wheelers in residential communities is just one more case of the Valley’s growing pains. The density is increasing, and more and more people are bumping into each other.

He said his office hears about 20 complaints each summer about four-wheelers, but there is little the borough can do. It is illegal to drive in the right-a-way, but signs don’t work and the troopers rarely enforce it, he said.

As for what property owner can do, Duffy said individuals do have a right to protect their property interests. However, permits are required to put barricades in public easements, and this opens them up to liability issues.

Unfortunately, this is a lesson Sarah Millay knows too well.

Millay lives south of Seldon on top of the hill. Snowmachiners and four-wheelers used to blast up the hill and right through her back yard. She was forced to build a fence to protect her daughter playing outside.

One day, a group of snowmachiners were riding in the ditch at the base of the hill below her house. The third rider in the line hit a rock and sued her for damages.

Her insurance company said she had to file a claim before they could give her any legal advice. Shortly after filing, the company settled with the snowmachiner because it was cheaper than getting attorneys involved. Millay is waiting to hear if her premiums are going to go up.

When she asked what she can to do prevent future claims, the insurance company told her she would have to keep the ditch clear of rocks. Even though it is not her property, plaintiffs can say the rocks fell from her yard.

“The rocks fall there because the hill gets torn up by the four-wheelers, and now I have to pick them up?” Millay said. “Some of them are watermelon size. I can’t lift that.”

Duffy said beside the money it is costing the local homeowners, tax payers have to foot the bill from the damages caused by four-wheelers. All around the borough, hydro-seeding has gone to waste, and road beds have been eroded to the point where streets crack and need repaving.

Other than the monetary issues, there are safety concerns as well, Duffy said. Four-wheelers create traffic hazards and compete with bicyclists and pedestrians. Children on four-wheelers passing cars on the highway is clearly a concern, he said.

“I think at some point in time we are going to have to change our current message of addressing this on a case by case basis,” Duffy said. “We’re going to need something more comprehensive and regular.”

As for now, Duffy said representatives from the borough, troopers and state Department of Transportation are meeting with residents of the Seldon Road Extension area to brainstorm solutions.

Contact Todd L. Disher at todd.disher@frontiersman.com or 352-2252.

Copyright © 2010 Frontiersman

Comments

102 comment(s)

    Rob in NH wrote on Sep 26, 2009 4:22 PM:

    " I hate four wheelers. I think the more time you spend on one the lower your IQ becomes. "

    Paul wrote on Jul 17, 2009 6:54 PM:

    " Respect and courtesy go hand and hand. I've always practiced it and I always will. I'll smile and wave and tell you to have a great day. Just do it with maturity and treat others the way you want them to treat you. I don't want ATV's banned. I just want to live and enjoy life without harrassment or seeing anyone get hurt. I thank the Frontiersman for bringing this problem to the public in the hopes that's all will be needed. I have my doubts but I can still hope. "

    Paul wrote on Jul 17, 2009 6:50 PM:

    " My name is Paul and I'm basically responsible for publicizing the problem we've had with 4 wheelers in the Seldon area. I would like to say I'm not new to the valley. I've lived here just about 35 years now. When I first arrived Teelands was an actual store. I have also spent over 21 years defending our freedom as a member of the military. I ride a 4 wheeler and a snow machine and I used to be a licensed guide in our great state. I would just like to be treated with respect. "

    territory girl wrote on Jul 17, 2009 9:09 AM:

    " It is just a few who are ruining for everyone. Parents need to monitor their children...if neighbors, or anyone sees bad behavier they need to tell the parents or contact police...riding at 2am,or rding in peoples yards is not acceptable. Its been dry so dust is expected..hey when there is groups of them they are eating dust too!!! Yes they should slow down!! Knik road with its bike trail ( Joe Reddington trail) ticks me off..you can't even cross it on your 4wheeler, then we get jerks who block other access and causes problems. We need rules!~ "

    John wrote on Jul 17, 2009 8:05 AM:

    " Obviously Four Wheelers is not who he/she claims to be. Seriously, how many 17 year-olds spell correctly and use proper punctuation? I smell an angry home owner trying to start trouble... "

    Born in Palmer Does Not live in Wasilla wrote on Jul 16, 2009 11:16 PM:

    " It is True.

    Boro or Bor are commonly used abbreviations for Borough. "

    snicker wrote on Jul 16, 2009 8:13 PM:

    " ..because the "ugh" take to long to type... "

    Hybrid wrote on Jul 16, 2009 7:26 PM:

    " to "To Hybrid":

    Get real. Boro is a commonly used abbreviation for borough.
    What rock have you been living under? "

    to Hybrid wrote on Jul 16, 2009 6:28 PM:

    " FYI....it's "borough"....not "boro". :) "

    Hybrid wrote on Jul 16, 2009 1:29 PM:

    " John Duffy says there is little the boro could do? Baloney. In the case of the two steep hills mentioned in the article above, a whole bunch of rip rap placed strategically there would solve the highmarking problem. For that matter, it wouldn't have to be the boro--the rocks could just magically appear overnight. (heh, heh)

    The other thing the boro and the state could do is make sure the liability laws are extremely clear and updated so that homeowners are not responsible for ditches that are not on their property. Ms. Millay's situation is beyond ridiculous! "

    watcher wrote on Jul 16, 2009 11:49 AM:

    " Its kids like the "four wheelers" blogger that give the rest of them a bad rap. Appearing to be lazy, unintelligent, bad-mannered and self-centered products of poor parenting. Nothing like a swift kick in the tail to help introduce them to the realities of intentionally provoking somebody on their own land. Might be a good wake-up call for the lad. "

    Palmer Farm wrote on Jul 16, 2009 9:30 AM:

    " to bonehead (how appropriate!);
    You're right. No matter where you live there's always going to be somebody doing something you don't like. But on your private property? At 3AM in the morning? So are you going to just sigh and say to yourself "Oh well...that's just the way it is!" when Power Wagon is shooting on your property? Maybe when I dump my garbage on your lawn? ? Shovel my horsecrap from my truck onto your front steps? Will you "get used to it, shut up or leave?" "

    No surprise... wrote on Jul 16, 2009 8:31 AM:

    " To 4 wheeler...You will be lucky if you don't get yourself in some real trouble with an attitude like yours. You must be joking. I don't think Talkeetna wants you either. It should come as no surprise that people are talking about licensing and age restrictions. Or banning ATV's outright. You make a good example of why. Perhaps someone will snap your picture and make you the poster boy for why ATV's should be severely restricted. "

    olddude wrote on Jul 16, 2009 7:58 AM:

    " To Four Wheelers....
    Your parents must be proud! I've known a few teens with an attitude like yours and they ended up in jail or dead. I sure hope you change your ways before it happens to you.
    Maybe 4 years in the Military would change your attitude. "

    to Four Wheelers wrote on Jul 16, 2009 7:56 AM:

    " Thank you for demonstrating the immaturity we've been talking about.

    Wow. Your parents must be so proud. Or are they ignorant back-water hicks who can't grasp the concept of respect, courtesy or the law either? Come riding through MY property sometime, son! I'd enjoy educating you on the perils of 'not caring' about that.... "

    Power Wagon wrote on Jul 16, 2009 7:52 AM:

    " to Four Wheelers;
    Your age shows. Well, not quite. My 12 yr old has more maturity and respect than you do. Good luck with that "I don't care" attitude. I'll look for you in the police blotter.

    But hey, the more I think about it...I've always been able to shoot in Alaska too. Why, one of the great things about living here was being able to go close by and target practice. So you know, by golly maybe I just don't care if it's your property...I'll start target shooting right outside your bedroom window! Same logic, right? (Idiot!) "

    BoneHead wrote on Jul 16, 2009 7:37 AM:

    " It doesn't matter where in the world you live, there is always going to be somebody doing something that you don't like. Anybody who spends ten minutes in the valley can tell that four wheelers and snow machines are a big part of life out here. Guess what, it's your choice what you let bother you, if you don't like, either get used to it, shut up, or leave! "

    Four Wheelers wrote on Jul 16, 2009 6:48 AM:

    " Four Wheeler riders can go wherever they want. I'm 17 and I am not gonna be told by anyone or anything what I can and can't do - if it's your yard tough, I didn't pay $800 to drive my wheeler up in Talkeetna, I live on KGB and I'm gonna drive it where I please and how I please. People who try to tell us what to do need to move away, I don't care if you paid for the property - riders rule. "

    Kathy wrote on Jul 16, 2009 1:37 AM:

    " I'm a motorcyclist and I don't like the corners where 4-wheelers throw rocks up onto the pavement. I think they should be ticketed if caught throwing rocks on the road creating a hazard. The roads are cleaned in Spring and the 4-wheelers mess it up. Please go slower around the corners. It creates a hazard for motorcyclists. I wish adult riders of 4-wheelers and motorcycles were required to wear helmets because when they are injured or killed the cost trickles down to the taxpayer in manhy ways. "

    Alabaster wrote on Jul 16, 2009 1:08 AM:

    " We have eleven acres and one of these "local trails" runs the length of it. Most of the time the locals are really cool about slowing down at our driveway and flying across like it isn't there. The people that get me are the ones that come here from Skankerage with 6 machines their screaming brood and their lovely mutts, who don't know the trail and could care less about anyone but themselves. If you travel to ride -have the decency to at least respect the place you are riding at! "

    Born in Palmer Does Not live in Wasilla wrote on Jul 15, 2009 11:37 PM:

    " To Also Fed Up;

    You wrote in first comment:

    "Fourwheelers and dirtbikes, the toys of choice for the feeble of leg and mind."

    You wrote in second comment:

    "we have the toys"

    You, sir or madam, are of feeble legs and mind.

    How pretentious of you to make sure that Frontiersman reader's know "all of them are American made."

    I'm sorry you have lost your freedom, perhaps you should go somewhere where you feel free. "

    PT wrote on Jul 15, 2009 8:42 PM:

    " Incredibly, I see 4 wheelers riding up Cruisy St.. (In the street)... like they have a registration or something. Also parked in parking spaces at Target...right across from the police station. I wonder if they ever look out the window. We wait for a white pedestrian crossing sign on the Parks Hwy., while across the street a 4 wheeler is waiting to drive across towards us in the same crossing. It's getting too blatant out there. Don't even get me started on the late night subdivision rides, bike path domination, and driveway erosion. "

    To Power Wagon wrote on Jul 15, 2009 6:21 PM:

    " Amen, I agree with you 100%. It should be called child endangerment to put a kid on a machine and send him into the street to ride unsupervised, and without a helmet. When he is finally an adult, let him do whatever he wants regarding safety. "

    Hybrid wrote on Jul 15, 2009 4:43 PM:

    " to "for four wheelers":
    Some people/riders in the Valley remind me of the Talkeetna vs Park Visitors Center controversy a few years ago wherein some Talkeetnans claimed to have moved to that town to get away from it all, then turned around years later saying they wanted jobs for their kids.
    Sorry bub, but if you moved to the valley to ride in less populated areas and then had kids, your math just doesn't add up.
    You need to take a class in logic.
    And where is it written that your activities supersede other people's rights? "

    Power Wagon wrote on Jul 15, 2009 3:07 PM:

    " to Gavyns;
    I agree. While I ride motorcycles, ATVs etc and agree with the safety involved in wearing a helmet, I have to admit that I'm 50/50 on when I wear a helmet and when I don't. I like that Alaska hasn't gone 'big brother' and told me that I have to. I'm a grown man and the choice is mine. But my kids aren't grown, and they don't get that option. They wear a helmet or they don't ride. Period. I often think that although I don't support helmet laws for adults, I wouldn't mind one for children. "

    kodiak87 wrote on Jul 15, 2009 1:19 PM:

    " Since the Troopers place a low priority on enforcing the laws regarding the use of ATVs, then apparently we need to begin campaigning with the DPS and demand that they do something.

    Growth has resulted in the Valley not being the open area it once was, and the rights of the majority who want to have a safe environment and a relatively quiet residential area most certainly out-number the inconsiderate riders.

    Let's demand that our represenatives in the legislature, the borough and in state govenment get off their behinds and get with it. "

    GavynsTutu wrote on Jul 15, 2009 11:49 AM:

    " I'm a recent visitor to your lovely state (was able to meet my 16 m/o grandson for the 1st time) and was shocked at all the young people (under 12 y/o) riding the 4and 2wheelers without any kind of protection (helmits). Even in my small town of Winters and outlying areas, we've had children dying from golf cart accidents because of no helmit. It's just a small consideration. "

    Also Fed Up- wrote on Jul 14, 2009 11:16 PM:

    " Lee, don't you even bully us and telling us to leave. We've been here long before you came for your kind of freedom that trashes our dreams and our hard work. Your name calling is juvenile and defies logic. Like Palmer Farm we have the toys, the SUVs, the trucks and farm equipment and yes, all of them are American made. You'd better be the one to go back where you came from because a bunch of us are ready to fight back and defend our rights to peace and happiness. "

    Palmer Farm wrote on Jul 14, 2009 8:30 PM:

    " lee;
    I own a little over 20 acres. I'm life-time NRA. I hunt. I fish. We own trucks (American brands only). We own several ATVs and snow machines since we have several children. We've lived in the valley since the '70s. But because I ALSO believe in property rights and common courtesy, that makes me and those like me "yuppies" or from "out of state"? Because I disagree that it's "alaskan" to be a loser and tread across people's yards or blow by thier house in the middle of the night? Grow up! "

    lee wrote on Jul 14, 2009 8:15 PM:

    " if you dont like it leave,,to many yuppies wanting to turn this state into there private little subdivisions....funny you mention rights and privileges, since many of you are not willing to give up youre personal loved rights or privileges but yet are demanding others should since they dont go with youre own personal enterest or things to do...privileges are also interpretive, meaning they have no force or effect and can be seen different ways by many..and riding atv's to clarify is not a privilege, its not a car, and its not operated on federally funded highway.. "

    Also Fed Up- wrote on Jul 14, 2009 6:13 PM:

    " My family has lost the freedoms which we thought came guaranteed with living in Alaska. Fourwheelers and dirtbikes, the toys of choice for the feeble of leg and mind, have been allowed to run unchecked and rampant all over the Valley for far too long. They have taken away our clean air, our safety to walk or bike, the peace and quiet around our homes day or night and, along with the damage they cause to roads and trails, they have seriously compromised the physical and mental health of many tax paying homeowners. MSB, please DO SOMETHING! "

    to cry a river wrote on Jul 14, 2009 11:51 AM:

    " Good point! And to celebrate what you call "freedom", how about I drive my Jeep across your lawn tomorrow morning at 2AM with my radio on? Maybe I can enjoy the "freedom" of letting my dogs crap all over your driveway?

    Oh, wait...that's not "freedom"....that's called "being an inconsiderate jerk".... "

    mary wrote on Jul 14, 2009 11:34 AM:

    " Put some of those spikes out that will pop the tires of 4 wheelers or stay up some nights and exercise your right for shooting practice.
    I'm pretty sure if those kids knew they were shot at, the parents (may) tell them not to ride at 3am.
    Who knows, maybe some noise ordinance might get implemented, oh, I forgot, the valley doesnt like rules. "

    Cry a river wrote on Jul 14, 2009 9:32 AM:

    " The valley wants to stay farm and backward, thus there will be tractors and 4 wheelers all over, like the rural, then love the freedom for all not your special interest that should be in the MOA. GO 4 wheelers and other recreational vehicles, you too deserve freedom. "

    no I dont think so wrote on Jul 14, 2009 9:28 AM:

    " "True Alaskan" thinks it's 'being Alaskan' to be a jerk and ride wherever he pleases, including private property. Nice. The rest of us that have ALSO lived out here all our lives ALSO miss being able to ride without worry about bothering anybody...but that doesn't change the fact that private property is private property and laws are laws, whether or not they were being previously enforced or not!

    Has nothing to do with 'moving from Anchorage'....we've been here since 1976. The growth isn't much fun but that doesn't mean we get behave like ignorant children. "

    True Alaskan wrote on Jul 13, 2009 11:22 PM:

    " Way to go... Lee, Alaskan Wheeler, Lulubell and Lovin Alaska...........
    This is the way of life out here if you don't like it go back to the city. You can have your bike trail on Knik too and give us back Joe Reddingtons dog trail. Bring back the idiarod going down Knik, the peacefulness, and the mail (moose) boxes on Knik road. AHHH those were the days...no traffic and people wee actually friendly!!! They move out here and want to change everything but they still let their dogs run free, heck thet live in the country!!! "

    for four wheelers wrote on Jul 13, 2009 11:05 PM:

    " I knew it was a matter of time before the Anchorage and out of state people who have moved to the Valley would start complaining about the four wheelers, snowmachines etc,,, I moved to the Valley 23 years ago after being raised in Anchorage. I moved here because it was like old Anch. also so my kids could ride their ATVs, snowmachines right out of the garage and go where ever. Real Alaska life!!! They put a bike trail on Knik, where Joe Reddington trail was! Home of the Iditarod (?) This is a dry summer, eat some dust!!! "

    Just Wait wrote on Jul 13, 2009 10:13 PM:

    " For those of you who cherish your 4-wheeler, dirt-bike riding and support the Knik Bridge, say goodbye to your riff-raff forever. Once that bridge goes in, your free riding will no longer be allowed as this bridge is going to bring more, traffic, more development and much, much more people. .. "

    misunderstood... wrote on Jul 13, 2009 11:14 AM:

    " i wasnt refering to bike paths.

    ugh.

    the trails along side of them...unpaved ones- is what i was refering to.

    i agree- stay off the bike paths!

    and another thing- people need to know that its is not legal to ride on borough roads i.e. subdivisions UNLESS you are on the shortest path to the real trails.

    and agian, PLEASE SLOW DOWN IN THE SUBDIVISIONS....BEFORE A CHILD GETS KILLED!!! "

    sickofthedust wrote on Jul 13, 2009 10:58 AM:

    " We own 4 Wheelers and enjoy riding them - out of town!!! Because people want to protect their home and personal property and not have to listen to the 4 wheelers and snow machines does not mean that they are "rich, yuppies, from Anchorage, from California, or everywhere else". It means they work hard, own their homes and take pride in what they have and are tired of our driveways getting tore up, the dust in our homes and the noise. "

    Power Wagon wrote on Jul 13, 2009 9:43 AM:

    " Those paved, borough-maintained paths along Knik are off-limits and illegal for motorized vehicles/ATVs. You cannot ride on them, period. (If you don't know that, then I see at least some of the problem here.) You are SUPPOSED to stay off of them (i.e. ride on the quad trail). I'm sure it's the same for the new on on Old Glenny Highway.

    Ignorance is no excuse. If you don't know the rules, don't ride off your property. "

    it is NOT illegal... wrote on Jul 13, 2009 8:22 AM:

    " to ride along the easements (right-of-ways) along Borough roads.

    You, sir, are wrong.

    However, as a rider and a parent of a rider, I see kids ripping through my neighborhood at all hours o the night.

    Parents police your kids.

    If not, the police will police them.

    And we will lose our privilege to ride along these trails.

    SLOW IN THE NEIGHBORHOODS.

    THAT GOES FOR MINIVAN MOMS, TOO. "

    to thomasAlex wrote on Jul 12, 2009 11:21 PM:

    " It IS illegal to ride ATVs and other motorized vehicles along the borough-maintained trails along KBG and now the Old Glenn Hwy. (usually paved or graded in crushed rock) What you are speaking of are the trails that spring up all over Alaska on the sides of the road. But even then, when and where those trails cross private property can still be an issue of the property owner wishes.

    I see several areas along KGB where riders will ride on the paved borough path when there's a quad trail mere feet away, because they like the pavement. "

    Seriously Concerned wrote on Jul 12, 2009 11:16 PM:

    " OMG!!! I see and Hear STUPID People!!! Obviously it is rediculous to be riding thru neighborhoods at 3am and on other peoples properties. But I suppose if you where an ignorant child with no upbringing you wouldn't be aware of that and if you were an adult with no brains and never worked hard for anything in your life you wouldn't understand the concern either. How sad some people are soooo ignorant they aren't able to consider any other perspective than the selfish perspective. Sadly it is the children who suffer the injuries. "

    To Mat-Su wrote on Jul 12, 2009 10:59 PM:

    " While your solution to have separated paths for motorized and off-road vehicles sounds appealing at first sight, have you considered the cost to the public for acquiring right-of-way for this purpose from mostly unwilling property owners and constructing these 4wheeler paths for $1 million per mile minimum? Wouldn't you rather have our existing road system fixed and improved? I sure would.

    To the horse owner: You may want to consider to remove your horse's droppings on a public pathway. As a horse owner myself, I don't expect anyone to step into my baby's doo-doo, dog or horse. "

    Confused on your rights wrote on Jul 12, 2009 10:49 PM:

    " Rights often get confused with privilege. People have the right to protect their property, it is a privilege to ride a 4 wheeler. Destroying property and being a nuisance is not a right. It isn't a right to be an American its a privilege to be an American. Before you go using who's rights are who's you may want to check the definition between a persons rights and a privilege. You have the right to remain silent it is a privilege to listen to your comments. No matter what only one is correct and not right. Understand? "

    thomasAlex wrote on Jul 12, 2009 7:48 PM:

    " Good thing it is not illegal to ride 4wheelers and motorcycles along the trails and sides of roadways. So I am confused with the statements made by the OP? From what I can read, he is annoyed and therefore does not agree with their Right to ride Recreational Vehicles in Wasilla. If this is the case, then instead of complaining, he needs to petition to have Wasilla Residents Rights removed. "

    ATV industry... wrote on Jul 12, 2009 4:00 PM:

    " Only a matter of time before the environmentalists take care of the ATV problem. A dust tax offset, road damage tax offset, noise tax offset, Taxes, taxes, taxes. They will have to avoid areas where there are mosquitos, and other insects so as not to upset the ecosystems. Forget crossing a stream. You think you have it bad now, just wait and see what is coming. You are already dead. You just don't know it yet. Remember, people would have said you were crazy 10 years ago if you had suggested that smoking would be banned..... "

    Lee wrote on Jul 12, 2009 10:42 AM:

    " make Alaska like Cali. where if you want to do anything you 1st have a permit, then a license and still pay a user fee and this is after you prove its a 4stroke...yeah that makes a lot of sense,,yeah there is a few bad apples, but then again there is hundreds of miles of Bike paths and millions spent building them and yet there is still bicyclists on the roads,, "

    Hybrid wrote on Jul 12, 2009 10:12 AM:

    " Lulubell:
    Riding at 3 am is "a bit annoying"? It doesn't take much more than the IQ of a cookie to realize what time it is at night even in the Alaskan summer. All these excuses to justify the kinds of petty lawlessness that are pervasive in the Valley are just plain disgusting. "

    Hybrid wrote on Jul 12, 2009 10:03 AM:

    " Uncle Jed:
    What have you got against little kids having a safe place to ride their bikes? Bicycles have been around for almost 200 years, well before snow machines and 4 wheelers. Are you against apple pie and Mom too?


    4 wheelers are fairly new; there were none in the early 70s in Alaska. Basically, the Valley subdivisions grew at the same rate as the development of ATVs. ATVs should have been regulated from the beginning as they absolutely should be now. The rude majority spoils it for the responsible few. "

    fiberfinn wrote on Jul 12, 2009 8:37 AM:

    " The borough should make the riding of 4-wheelers illegal within the populated areas of the borough. Not only are they a safety risk for walkers and bike riders, they are a health risk to those who have respitory problems. The dust created by these machines along Bogard road actually makes it difficult to see at times. Homeowners have to continually dust and it's impossible to save on energy by hanging clothes out to dry. They are also used on sidewalks meant for walking and handicapped individuals using their electric carts. Get rid of them!! "

    Lovn Alaska wrote on Jul 12, 2009 7:28 AM:

    " Respect goes both ways! I moved to to Wasilla 5 years ago from WA state. I chosse Wasilla for the pure fact it has the country feel and kids get to be kids (by riding 4-wheelers and snow machines). If we can spend millions on bike paths, we can spend millions on trails for riders. After all, this AK and a way of life up here. Don't move to the country and expect to make it a city because you have arrived. Instead of complaining, push for trails right next to bike paths. "

    Joey wrote on Jul 11, 2009 7:59 PM:

    " When you don't enforce the rules people don't obey them. until the politicians and the police understand that your just out of luck. Just keep voting for the same fools that you have been and get more of the same. "

    Grew up Riding wrote on Jul 11, 2009 6:09 PM:

    " I live off KGB, born here and raised riding and all for it, but now the difference is lack of respect and common courtesy. But because todays riders act like ill mannered spoiled brats I say ban 'em , give them what they deserve. "

    akjill wrote on Jul 11, 2009 3:50 PM:

    " The folks quoted in the story aren't trying to ban atv's... they are just asking them to be cool. Go slow in the neighborhoods, wave with all your fingers. "

    Rights wrote on Jul 11, 2009 1:35 PM:

    " What the Anarchists are arguing is that the person with the least respect for others wins. You don't have any rights except those you are willing to fight for. Anarchists will always find their way of life under attack by civilization. That's why they move further out. So, I guess it's time for all of you to move again. "

    If it isnt yours wrote on Jul 11, 2009 1:21 PM:

    " If it isn't yours, it isn't YOURS. Plain and simple. The argument that people were riding there first is just people admitting that they were riding on someone else's property illegally. The real property owners sold it to someone who developed it. What part of "NOT YOURS" don't you understand. Just because a property is undeveloped and covered in trees doesn't mean you can just roll in there and use it as it's your own. Why don't you buy your own acreage to ride on?? "

    Church Road Resident wrote on Jul 11, 2009 1:19 PM:

    " I don't mind the motor-play, or even the noise of these things but these motorized vehicles have taken over all the walkways, paved and unpaved.

    Walking is a hazardous activity in/around the Church Road area because the ATV drivers aren't following known traffic rules.

    If people are so lazy that they can't take these recreational vehicles to the hundreds of acres of NON populated areas - I think they should be forced to pass a test to drive these things.

    Or I should be able to pipe bagpipe music into THEIR parents bedrooms at night... "

    Palmer Farm wrote on Jul 11, 2009 12:42 PM:

    " It's interesting to see those on the lower end of the IQ make themselves known. The whole mentality of "it's about freedom" or "being Alaskan" or "you must be from California" to justify being a jerk.
    We've lived here longer than 90% of the kids and younger "me first" generations we see on the machines (we were born before most of them). And like the analogy used before; perhaps they wouldn't mind if I dumped my garbage on thier lawn? Is that 'freedom' and 'being Alaskan' too? I guess it's like they say; you can't fix stupid. "

    Meadow_Lakes_Madman wrote on Jul 11, 2009 12:32 PM:

    " I suppose some of these same people would expect me to dismount from my horse and bag any poo that he drops?

    For you ATV riders, you're only catching heck because a of few rude people. Police your own as any group will do...and oh yeah watch out for horses. "

    To Olddude wrote on Jul 11, 2009 11:56 AM:

    " Very well said. Especially the "moron" part. "

    AKSINCE 1952 wrote on Jul 11, 2009 11:34 AM:

    " WELL PUT OLDDUDE. Respect for property went out with the new "you owe it to me mentality." We respected people and property and if we didn't we soon wished we had. Licensing and proper enforcement is the answer. Parental control is badly needed. Trooper and police enforcement is an absolute must. Perhaps a patrolling ATV would help and confiscation would eleiminate and fund it. "

    olddude wrote on Jul 11, 2009 11:21 AM:

    " You morons that think you can ride anywhere,anytime are going to ruin it for all.
    I lived in Alaska for going on 50 years and it's out of hand. Time to register all ATV's ,just like the boats and snow machines. Put a nice big number on them so you have a way to track them down.
    You can weed out the bad apples in a hurry! We pay property taxes. Time for the borough to listen to concerned property owners. "

    Mat-Su wrote on Jul 11, 2009 9:56 AM:

    " What IF:::They actually planned for the uses that have historically used the ditches for years, when they design and build new roadways???
    It's called separated pathways.
    On one side of the street is a paved non-motorized pathway to get bicyles off the hiways,, and on the other side is a paved motorized pathway, that way no dust.
    Then Iif there is any variances from the pathways, like up hills and such, like hiways , there would be ENFORCEMENT of the rules. Wow what a concept. Thought and compatibility,instead of whining and banning. "

    AKSINCE 1952 wrote on Jul 11, 2009 9:50 AM:

    " If you don't own the land, stay off it. If it's illegal to ride the bike path, stay off it. If private property rules are not observed mayhem results. Unlicensed drivers and unlicensed vehicles are a hazard. Unsupervised children and ignorant adults are the problem. Troopers need to ticket and arrest trespassers and vandals. period. Fines and eventual loss of the offending machines will eliminate the problem. Right of Ways are not in place for 4 wheelers or snow machines but like moose they look for the easiest path. "

    NIMBY wrote on Jul 11, 2009 9:25 AM:

    " The bottom line is keep off of private property and obey the law! Keep having your fun terrorizing the neighborhood and soon a few of you bad apples are gonna ruin it for all. They outlawed 3 wheelers, 4 wheelers are next. "

    lulubell wrote on Jul 11, 2009 9:11 AM:

    " WAA! I am tired of people comeing to the Valley from Anchorage andwhere ever else and complaining about four wheelers! I live in the valley for the freedom that we don't have in the city.I am sure there were four wheeler trails through "your" neighborhoods befor they were "your neighborhoods@! If you don't like four wheelers and snowmachines then move to the city! I do agree that 3 am in a residential neighborhood is a bit annoying but in the land of the midnight sun maby they just didn't realize the time. "

    Concerned Resident wrote on Jul 11, 2009 8:05 AM:

    " It's pretty bad when you worry about pulling out of your driveway because you're afraid some Teenager is going to fly by your driveway as fast as can be. I live a few streets down from Seldon & it's bad on our street as well. And Most of the kids I see are not wearing a helmet and I've actually watched a kid on a 4 Wheeler with someone on back (both not wearing helmets) pull out in front of a car coming down Lucille street. People need to grow up and be respectful of others AND their property! "

    Uncle Jed to ag wrote on Jul 11, 2009 1:49 AM:

    " Do you ride your bike down the side of the road, wearing spandex and eating granola. are you from Californa? I would rather look at a 4-wheeler than you. "

    Mosquito wrote on Jul 10, 2009 9:23 PM:

    " The problem exists along KGB too. 4-wheelers, motorcycles and the occasional car race on the paved bike path. If I had children, I wouldn't allow them on this nice and long bike path for fear of them being killed. The 4-wheelers and motorcyles have torn up the small and short (once nicely graveled) road I live off of. It got blocked off by logs and rocks so they retaliated and have been making at least one donut hole a day virtually stripping all the gravel off so now the road is just a dust trail. "

    ag wrote on Jul 10, 2009 8:21 PM:

    " Put your fat assed little ATV riding kids on an actual bicycle, you know, one that you have to peddle!

    That way we might not have to stare at these out of shape parents and children motoring around while they should be walking or biking. "

    Alaskanwheeler wrote on Jul 10, 2009 8:08 PM:

    " the answer is simple, QUIT buying up all our riding areas you stupid imports, this is Alaska if you cant deal with wheelers, you moved to the wrong place, born in bred Alaska im sick of what you wining Yeppies are trying to do, move into MY neighborhood and then iomplain about the way it is, Shut up and go back to California this is ALASKA and we ride "

    Lee wrote on Jul 10, 2009 7:42 PM:

    " been riding in that area for many, many, many, many years, way before any alleged road development was even thought of, and long before even 3/4 of the people lived here in the valley...thank the city of Wasilla and DOT for putting "Bike" trails over existing trails that have been used by Wheelers and Snow Machines for Year's to the even more traffic being consolidated outwards, tag this with the ever increasing harassment by WPD's Maud squad and you might clue in.. "

    khbalaska wrote on Jul 10, 2009 7:13 PM:

    " Ban em, while I'm not a fan of these yahoos destroying our neighborhood and peace of life, what you're suggesting actually happened several years ago. The person was almost totally beheaded. Not funny. "

    Sick of them too wrote on Jul 10, 2009 5:15 PM:

    " I am glad that I am not the only one that is annoyed by this. The citizens should unite to do something to keep this under control. ATV's and snowmachines already have established zones to ride in - they need to stay off of private property and out of the roadway ROW. "

    raizncain wrote on Jul 10, 2009 4:57 PM:

    " I live near a main trail I hear you but I got over it .(trail less than 50 ft from bedroom window) I'm no lawer but I do believe it's illeagle to block and bobbie-trap trails.and if someone dies and they find out you did it con you say murder.yuppies go back to your towns here in the COUNTRY we ride "

    Keep it up wrote on Jul 10, 2009 3:54 PM:

    " Keep disregarding the law and common courtesy. One day 4 wheelers will be banned because of you and you'll have no one to complain to because you'll have spoiled it for all. Riders who use their machines appropriately will suffer the consequences of these morons. Too bad. I won't miss the noise and dust. Take them all away. (and yes I grew up with it too..... doesn't make it right) "

    Off road wrote on Jul 10, 2009 3:49 PM:

    " I think the label Off Road Vehicle says it all. There are miles and miles of trails and off roading to be had in Alaska, so why do they choose to ride on roads and neighborhoods? Parent's are to blame for not instructing their children in safe and courteous riding rules and being too lazy to take them to the appropriate places to ride. They purchase these machines for their kids and just let them loose. The fact that you'll usually get the finger when you confront them says it all. Parents are to blame! "

    Power Wagon wrote on Jul 10, 2009 3:37 PM:

    " Whoa, whoa...a 'wire about neck high'? Good lord...these rude jerks annoy me as much as the next guy but c'mon...that's just a bit over the top, don't you think? "

    crazy talk wrote on Jul 10, 2009 3:23 PM:

    " to ban em

    You are morbid. Insinuating that you would try to cut the head off of somebody by putting up a wire neck high is something someone as low as Butcher Baker would do. The blood is on your hands if someone does this. "

    Ban em wrote on Jul 10, 2009 2:54 PM:

    " Nice tight wire about neck high works well. "

    mom in wasilla wrote on Jul 10, 2009 1:21 PM:

    " What if 4 wheelers became street legal? The Borough would require them to be equipped with equipment such as rear view mirrors and turn signals. Then the drivers would complete a recreation vehicle course, just like motorcyclers, and have that special license. Then, safer 4 wheelers and operators would be sharing the streets. This would give them more freedom of movement, and not encroach on all this private land, etc.
    Just thought I would throw this out there. "

    Darwin Awards wrote on Jul 10, 2009 1:10 PM:

    " given enough time these guys will cull themselves "

    Eric wrote on Jul 10, 2009 1:01 PM:

    " And AK leads all other states in injuries and deaths by ATVS yet we don't have that many people. Just a simple fact so take how you want. Born here or transplanted is irrelevant. And being in AK is not a Carte Blanche to be stupid. "

    He raiser wrote on Jul 10, 2009 12:28 PM:

    " Funny thing is a Trooper lives right across the street from this spot. Probably too much hassle for him to try to do something. Tack strips work great. "

    dbrrr0 wrote on Jul 10, 2009 12:07 PM:

    " 30 to 40 miles per hour on a bike path daily wasilla-fishhook and seldon. Kids and adults are breaking the law. Someone will eventually be killed. Way to "police the neighborhood Troopers. Private property has no right of way! Noise pollution and dust. Thanks ignorant neighbors. "

    to keep our freedom wrote on Jul 10, 2009 11:55 AM:

    " Interesting attempt to turn being rude and childish into 'freedom'. Hey, maybe 'freedom' means my dogs can come take a crap in your yard. Maybe I should have the 'freedom' to stand outside your house and blow an air-horn while you're trying to sleep.

    Don't get acting like a jerk confused with 'freedom'. "

    respect wrote on Jul 10, 2009 10:34 AM:

    " I saw a motorbike speeding on the bike path along the parks highway by Lucas street. He was kicking up all kinds of dust..flying full bore! The inconsiderate riders are making a bad name for the ones who are respectful. "

    keep our freedom wrote on Jul 10, 2009 10:32 AM:

    " Grumpy Old ...needs to get over it or move. He is just another trying to take away another freedom. Life is too short to waste. We live here because we can ride our atvs & snowmachines. I would rather listen to the noise & put up with the dust than have kids vandalize everything else. Does Mr. Reed remember when he was younger? People who complain should just move back to the city they came from. "

    Outlaw Them. wrote on Jul 10, 2009 10:17 AM:

    " Hey I don't want to pay local taxes anymore. Do you think I'd get away with that. Heck no. So why is it our Troopers and local police won't enforce all the laws? In the end it would save the life's of many young kids that have absent, just get out of here and go play in the traffic, I'm too busy to watch you right now, PARENTS! Every time I read about some one getting killed I think how easily this could have been prevented. The blood is on your hands, Local Police, Parents and Legislators. "

    Respect in Seldon wrote on Jul 10, 2009 9:30 AM:

    " Its a matter of respect. Riders of anything need to respect others property and be considerate of people. We dont want to stop the riding we just want them to control their noise and behavior. I have lived here all my life and have had to deal with these things. treat each other with respect and sensible people usually understand and reciprocate. If it fails then place barracades in their way and they will move to somewhere else. Problem solved!
    Both these subdivisions have a no ATV policy in their HOA and they comply by it. so its not them. "

    Palmer Farm wrote on Jul 10, 2009 9:10 AM:

    " 'Boobhoo' is another example of somebody with the perfect blog name.

    And to him, Uncle Jed and others; We've lived here for 30 years. We enjoy riding and have machines. But only an arrogant, self-centered creep rides his/her machine around within earshot of people's homes during all hours of the night. Maybe I can come over by your house and do some logging at 3AM? Tune my street rod? Play some music full-blast?
    Grow up. "

    To We grew up riding.. wrote on Jul 10, 2009 9:06 AM:

    " Thank you for your comments. It really sums up what should be done. Some parents need to think about the financial liability of their unsupervised child riding an ATV hitting a pedestrian or car while speeding down a residential street. As a taxpayer, I think that the ATV industry and riders should have their feet held to the fire for all the damage they do to the edges of the roadways and the environmental damage they inflict. Think before you ride! Or it is only a matter of time before riding is banned. "

    allisaw wrote on Jul 10, 2009 9:05 AM:

    " pay attention, these kids' parents probably drive the same way. that's how they were taught. kids will be kids and grumpy old frts will be grumpy old frts. who ever is louder will win. "

    khbalaska wrote on Jul 10, 2009 8:47 AM:

    " Or maybe it's the morons FROM Anchorage visiting out in the valley creating havoc... They seems to think that just because it's the valley that it's their personal playground regardless of who lives there. Signed, from Big Lake. "

    in wasilla wrote on Jul 10, 2009 6:45 AM:

    " Most of these areas have been used for 20plus years by ATV's..BEFORE this road was even in place. Have to fact the fact that there are some who don't like to see others have fun. "

    boobhoo wrote on Jul 10, 2009 12:57 AM:

    " This sounds like another complainer who moved here from Anchorage. "

    we grew up riding wrote on Jul 9, 2009 10:44 PM:

    " and we were respectful of private property, hours of the day, and speeds in the neighborhood.

    now, its all nite, full throttle, and hazardous riding.

    we do not want to have our privilege taken away.

    police your kids.

    take the neighborhoods back.

    and parents-lead by example and drive SLOWLY in the neighborhoods.

    thanks!

    Honda CR125R
    Honda CR50F
    Honda CR250X
    Wasilla "

    Power Wagon wrote on Jul 9, 2009 10:28 PM:

    " What a crock of crap! Especially the part about the machiner suing the gal over the rock!
    I think I'd find some creative ways for it be very unpleasant for the jerks to ride through there. "

    ag wrote on Jul 9, 2009 9:42 PM:

    " Big giant logs and metal posts sunk into the ground seem to deter these types of vehicles, especially after they run into them a few times during the dark hours :-) "

    Uncle Jed wrote on Jul 9, 2009 8:33 PM:

    " All these rich people moving out here need to stop trying to tame the valley. Eagle River might be a better place for them. "

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